Said Something in German | If SSIW is helping you, why not help us? Get DAILY lessons: Become an SSIW Member!

Re: Said Something in German

Postby Cwlen » Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:37 pm

Yup, I agree. "Ich hätte gerne eine Tasse Kaffee" is what would use also, it litereally means something close to "I would like having a cup of coffee.

But SSiG... well I indeed thought about creating something like that already, it's just I fear the SSiW concept wouldnt work very well with German... :(

Greeting,

Mike
Please correct my Welsh!

When the lord gave people their languages, the Welsh were a little late and no tongues were left.

So God gave them his own.

Salvete, mellyn nín! You müsst siarad Suomi e moi!
Cwlen
SSiW Member
 
Posts: 36
Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:26 pm
Location: Cologne
Real name:: Mike

Re: Said Something in German

Postby RedGreenInBlue » Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:01 pm

Cwlen wrote:But SSiG... well I indeed thought about creating something like that already, it's just I fear the SSiW concept wouldnt work very well with German... :(

Don't give Aran ideas! :shock: Well, not until (cough, cough*) SSiW Course 3 is done, anyway.… Even hardly knowing him, I can just tell that he'll do it just to prove you wrong! :lol:

* O dîar, mae gen i beswch ofnadwy ar hyn o bryd…**

**
Sorry, Aran, if you read this - you know we're all absurdly grateful for what you've already created. Just couldn't resist!
Chaiff y chwyldro mo'i ddangos ar S4/C,
Ddim hyd yn oed wysnos ar ôl iddo ymddangos ar Sianel 4
efo cyflwyniad gan Melvyn Bragg…
Achos fydd y chwyldro ddim ar y teledu, gyfaill.
User avatar
RedGreenInBlue
SSiW Member
 
Posts: 1108
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 5:46 pm
Location: Stockport, Lloegr
Real name:: Peter

Re: Said Something in German

Postby lambiek » Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:51 am

Cwlen wrote:Yup, I agree. "Ich hätte gerne eine Tasse Kaffee" is what would use also, it litereally means something close to "I would like having a cup of coffee.

But SSiG... well I indeed thought about creating something like that already, it's just I fear the SSiW concept wouldnt work very well with German... :(

Greeting,

Mike


If I am not mistaken, both "ich hätte gerne" and "ich möchte" are very similar to the Welsh constructs "hoffwn" and "liciwn", i.e. a subjunctive, which English can only express in a circumlocutory way...
Mae syniadau gwyrddion di-liw yn cysgu'n wyllt
User avatar
lambiek
SSiW Member
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:50 pm
Location: Darlington, De Cymru Newydd, Awstralia
Real name:: Louis

Re: Said Something in German

Postby Cwlen » Mon Dec 05, 2011 9:07 am

Well, "hätte" is the subjunctive of "haben", =to have. For the adjective "gerne" there's no real direct english translation (at least not coming to my mind, "gladly" is maybe the closest), so if you do something gerne it means you like/enjoy doing it. With "möchte" it' is like with "hätte", only the verb is "mögen" = to like.

And by that we are at why I think SSiW won't work very well with German: The words change like there was no tomorrow based on the context. One would have to work with word stems rather than infinitives and explain suffixes and what not... it's just a lawless language. Or well, actually there are rules for virtually every even smallest thing, but so many irregularities. It's a bit more difficult to turn "I speak" into "You speak" than just replacing "Dw i'n" with "Ti'n", and not just because "sprechen" (=to speak) is an irregular verb, like so many.

The Welsh forms you mentioned I've not learned yet, but if it is like you say, then liciwn gwybod yn fanwl! :)

Greetings,

Mike
Please correct my Welsh!

When the lord gave people their languages, the Welsh were a little late and no tongues were left.

So God gave them his own.

Salvete, mellyn nín! You müsst siarad Suomi e moi!
Cwlen
SSiW Member
 
Posts: 36
Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:26 pm
Location: Cologne
Real name:: Mike

Re: Said Something in German

Postby DafyddyFelin » Mon Dec 05, 2011 9:26 am

I would tend to take a contrary view. Is the problem of German word endings any different in principle from Welsh mutations I wonder? Unless you are a grammar freak, I would have thought the SSiW approach would be ideal as you would learn the right form by hearing and using in context so developing a "feel" for the language instead of laboriously memorising rules and tables. I can't believe this is beyond the SSiW method.

Die nächste Herausforderung! SSiG!
User avatar
DafyddyFelin
Gorsedd SSiW
 
Posts: 705
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2010 11:25 pm
Location: Newport, Shropshire

Re: Said Something in German

Postby Cwlen » Mon Dec 05, 2011 9:36 am

Well that is one very good point too, indeed... :wow:
Please correct my Welsh!

When the lord gave people their languages, the Welsh were a little late and no tongues were left.

So God gave them his own.

Salvete, mellyn nín! You müsst siarad Suomi e moi!
Cwlen
SSiW Member
 
Posts: 36
Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:26 pm
Location: Cologne
Real name:: Mike

Re: Said Something in German

Postby lambiek » Mon Dec 05, 2011 10:17 am

Cwlen wrote:Well that is one very good point too, indeed... :wow:


I believe that the German word endings are no more complicated than the Welsh - but unfortunately also not less - nor more lawless...
In fact, pretty well all (European) languages that I know are more complex than English in this regard, which is really quite simple when it comes to verb conjugation.
As to irregular verbs, I suspect that course 3 might[*] cover some of that stuff, but I am not sure.


[*] I think I just used a subjunctive of some sort, drat!
Mae syniadau gwyrddion di-liw yn cysgu'n wyllt
User avatar
lambiek
SSiW Member
 
Posts: 980
Joined: Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:50 pm
Location: Darlington, De Cymru Newydd, Awstralia
Real name:: Louis

Re: Said Something in German

Postby Pili-pala » Tue Dec 06, 2011 11:31 am

I think what might make a German course more difficult than the Welsh one is that you can't shorten things. What I mean is that in Welsh (similar to English) you can express everything by using "dw i'n ..." which is of course "I am ..." There is no progressive form in German, so you can't use the verbs in a similar way.

If you want to compare it with Welsh, compare it with the short-form verbs and their forms: hoffwn i, hoffet ti, hoffech chi and so on. You've got to learn the stem of the verb as well as the personal endings, just like you have to in German. That's what makes it most uncomfortable for foreign learners.
And a few other things like adjectives changing their forms, three instead of just two (Welsh) or no (English) word genders...

As for the sentences asked for earlier: you can also change the word order and put "bitte" more at the front.

Ich möchte bitte eine Tasse Kaffee. (Which is basically the same as "Ich hätte gerne eine Tasse Kaffee.)
All the best, Pili-pala

Please feel free to correct me (English or Welsh).
User avatar
Pili-pala
SSiW Member
 
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Jun 25, 2009 10:49 am
Location: Germany, near Hamburg

Re: Said Something in German

Postby Lostforwords » Mon Mar 05, 2012 10:31 pm

gabcor25 wrote:. . . do you know the origin of the [Welsh] word [moyn]? In Flensburg (GER) people greet each other with “Moin” and it is also used in southern Denmark in the form of “Mojn”. But this word has probably different roots:

“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moin

The word derives from the Dutch, Frisian, and Low German word mo(o)i, meaning "beautiful" or "good"
Gaby


Since it is in wikipedia it must be so. But I wonder, is it not more likely to be merely the sloppy/casual way of saying "(Guten) Morgen" - sounding just like moyn. As has been pointed out by another board member the Welsh language will soon collapse under its abbreviations and contractions, eg yr ydwyf = dw i; 'ddwn - 'swn etc. So what's good enough for the goose . . . :wink:
Any thoughts?
Dw i'n bwriadu i fyw am byth - iawn hyd yma.
"Do not fear going forward slowly; fear only to stand still." Chinese Proverb
Lostforwords
SSiW Member
 
Posts: 764
Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 9:17 pm
Location: Reading
Real name:: Fred

Re: Said Something in German

Postby Armyn Caer » Tue Mar 20, 2012 10:48 am

No "moin" is definitively not shortened for "guten morgen" as you use it as general greeding all day long. Also it is a greeding in the Plattdeutsch (low german) regions in Germany, where the language is very connected to dutch.

As to the Coffee discussion: If you are in Vienna (and general in Austria) you should generally use the subjunctive and "bitte" more often, as it is considered as polite.
"Ich hätte (bitte) gerne...", "Könnte ich (bitte)...", Würden sie mit (bitte)..."
Second, If you order a coffee in Austria, you don´t plainly order "coffee" but specify what sort of coffee you´d like to have: Melange, Kapuziner, Verlängerter, Einspänner, Fiacker, Kaisermelange, Maria Theresia, Tasse Gold; Milchkaffee, Käferlkaffee, Kleiner Brauner, Großer Brauner, Mokka, Cafe au lait, Frappé, etc.
Just in case you visit Kaffeehaus...
User avatar
Armyn Caer
 
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:22 am





 


PreviousNext

Return to German

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest