Just tried out my new Welsh, very disappointed | If SSIW is helping you, why not help us? Get DAILY lessons: Become an SSIW Member!

[AlexTigers]

I just tried to use my newly learnt Welsh on another forum I frequent.

It was a very discouraging experience. I was told it sounded clunky and awkward and I wasn't getting the mutations right. (I probably wasn't, but I thought it didn't matter)

So I said "mae'n ddrwg da fi, dw i ddim yn gallu siarad Cymraeg yn dda" (from the bonus lesson) and was told it was an odd turn of phrase and I should use "mae'n ddrwg gen i" instead. Not the best start to my using Welsh!

[Tahl]

I just tried to use my newly learnt Welsh on another forum I frequent.

It was a very discouraging experience. I was told it sounded clunky and awkward and I wasn't getting the mutations right. (I probably wasn't, but I thought it didn't matter)

So I said "mae'n ddrwg da fi, dw i ddim yn gallu siarad Cymraeg yn dda" (from the bonus lesson) and was told it was an odd turn of phrase and I should use "mae'n ddrwg gen i" instead. Not the best start to my using Welsh!

That *is* discouraging, and whoever criticized you should be ashamed of themselves. Honestly.

Getting things wrong and making mistakes with mutations *doesn't* matter. (This is what Nia Parry, the host of Hwb, says over and over when she is teaching on the show.) People will understand you, and first-language Welsh speakers don't get them all right all the time and are very, very understanding of our learner mistakes.

I notice that most times when people encounter jerks and get corrected by them, the 'correctors' are either (a) learners falling into the 'you don't say things the only way that I actually know how to say them, so you must be wrong' trap, or (b) speakers whose Welsh skills have decayed and who have become defensive about their command of the language.

Honestly, most people are not like this.

By the way....there's nothing wrong with 'mae'n ddrwg 'da fi.' If you'd like another authority on that, here's the BBC: http://www.bbc.co.uk/wales/catchphrase/ ... 44.shtml?5
You'll see there are southernish formulations (mae'n flin 'da fi) and northernish formulations (mae'n ddrwg gen i), but what you said *does* work.

[hewrop]

I agree 100% with Diane. Not only is the criticism you received anti-supportive it is wrong and ignorant . I'd love to know the name of the forum so that I can be sure to avoid it.

Dal ati ychan and ignore pratt comments.

[AlexTigers]

thanks for the messages of support.

You're probably right, Tahl, it was probably someone being defensive. He (or she, it's not clear!) stated elsewhere on the forum that he was a native speaker but hadn't used his Welsh for years. Still, "clunky and awkward"? Bit harsh, I thought!

I'm sorry, I'd rather not give the link, because I am already quite identifiable on here to people who know me. I have stated my location, occupation, family status, etc, and may become even more identifiable as time goes on and I wish to use Skype to practise my Welsh. On the other forum I am completely anonymous and wish to remain so. I don't want to lose my anonymity on there by people from there following me through a link here.

[Tahl]

You're probably right, Tahl, it was probably someone being defensive. He (or she, it's not clear!) stated elsewhere on the forum that he was a native speaker but hadn't used his Welsh for years.

Aha. There ya go.

Here's a recent thread discussing another SSiWer's encounter with someone bent on 'correcting' his Welsh:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=6764
There are quite a few thoughtful responses in that thread.

[jstetson]

On the other forum I am completely anonymous and wish to remain so. I don't want to lose my anonymity on there by people from there following me through a link here.

From what you've reported about it so far, that seems like a really good idea.

[Wil-ab-Eynon]

I just tried to use my newly learnt Welsh on another forum I frequent.

It was a very discouraging experience. I was told it sounded clunky and awkward and I wasn't getting the mutations right. (I probably wasn't, but I thought it didn't matter)

So I said "mae'n ddrwg da fi, dw i ddim yn gallu siarad Cymraeg yn dda" (from the bonus lesson) and was told it was an odd turn of phrase and I should use "mae'n ddrwg gen i" instead. Not the best start to my using Welsh!

Well I've been learning Welsh off and on since the 70s and I would say exactly what you said... and I've never had any problems with it at all.

Looks like the person you bumped into was having a bad hair day.... Just put it behind you and cadw ymlan... your doing brill'

Big cwtch for being so brave and dal ati ;) you'll get there...

[vgh50]

I get very angry and upset when I hear stories like this, I haven't had many 'Welsh in the Wild' experiences, but every one I've had has been positive.

I am shocked and disgusted that there are Welsh speaking Welsh people out there who can be so negative towards a Welsh learner.

I hope you won't let this experience discourage you; this person is in the minority and is obviously a fool. Keep up the good work and don't ever be afraid of making mistakes because that's all part of learning.

The fact that you're putting yourself out there shows you have a great attitude to learing Welsh and I suspect you'll do extremely well, so keep going and come back and tell us about the great and inspiring experiences that you will no doubt have in the future

[Aran]

So I said "mae'n ddrwg da fi, dw i ddim yn gallu siarad Cymraeg yn dda" (from the bonus lesson) and was told it was an odd turn of phrase and I should use "mae'n ddrwg gen i" instead.

Same old same old! As I said on a similar recent thread (the one Diane links to above, I think), as soon as I read that I thought 'Hang on, no ordinary Welsh speaker would bat an eyelid at 'mae'n ddrwg 'da fi'' - and lo and behold, your tormentor 'hasn't used his/her Welsh in years' - okay - in other words, he or she is not currently a Welsh speaker, and may never have been interested in it. You'll often see this kind of attitude in people who had a Welsh education but came from English-speaking homes, and dropped the language like a hot potato as soon as they got out of school.

Then, years down the line, they come across an enthusiastic learner, and all they can think to do is try to mark their own status by knocking down the learner - in ways which are usually pretty laughable to any confident Welsh speaker, but which can be successfully intimidating and negative to an early stage learner.

I've got very, very little time for people like this. The phrase you quoted here, Alex, is perfect, 100% correct - and shows that you're not a 'pure' no-reading-or-writing learner, too...

But you'll probably find that you get much more positive responses, and have a much more enjoyable time, setting up some SSiW Skype conversations...

[tehuti]

As well as learning with SSiW, I go to formal lessons in southern dialect run by Prifysgol Morgannwg and geared towards official exams. We have been taught both "mae'n flin 'da fi" and "mae'n ddrwg 'da fi" as being correct expressions to convey regret or an apology.